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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    3

    Unhappy Am I driving it wrong? Throttle issues

    I have a 2011 SES with a manual transmission. I previously drove a 2000 VW Beetle (not the turbo version), also manual. That's the car I learned stick shift on.

    I tend to drive the car a little hard, so I'm used to making the mistake of holding down the gas as I disengage the clutch (push the pedal down). This tends to have the effect of blipping the throttle (revs) higher. I would make this mistake sometimes on the Beetle, and I would hear the engine rev higher. I have also made the same mistake on the Fiesta. What I'm saying is, I know what this sounds like. This is not the same problem I'm about to describe.

    A similar sound and throttle blip occur when I disengage the clutch without leaving my foot on the accelerator. I will be shifting from second to third (for example) in the Fiesta, so I will take my foot off the gas and disengage the clutch. Instead of slowing down, the engine will continue to spin at the same speed it has been spinning and sometimes even speed up for 1-2 seconds before finally slowing down. This creates a subtle jolt in the car if I put it back in gear before the engine has slowed down to the appropriate speed for the next gear.

    Why does the engine have so much momentum and not slow down right away? And why in the world would it speed up after I disengage the clutch and let off the accelerator? Is there still fuel being pumped into the engine just after I let off the accelerator? Or is the engine just very different from the Beetle's and I just need to get over it and get used to it?

    I haven't gotten it checked out by the dealer yet, because I might just be crazy. I mentioned it to my sales rep and he muttered something about the car having a different flywheel to help the PowerShift transmission make its shifts smooth, and that the same part made it into the manual. Is he correct? Can someone describe what he means?

    Anyway, I could just be imagining problems, but thanks for reading!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
    Posts
    985

    Default

    Well, there might be a couple reasons for the issue you are encountering.

    Firstly, The 2000 VW Beetle with the 2.0 I think still had a throttle cable. This was a direct line between your foot on the gas and the throttle valve. The 2011 Fiesta is Drive-by-Wire and does not have a throttle cable in the traditional sense. The gas pedal is connected to the cars ECU and then to the throttle by electronics. I've noticed myself that the revs 'hang' for a second or two when you blip the throttle while at a standstill - and even when they fall off back to idle, it is a slowed process. This can be accounted for by the programming between the ECU and throttle to some degree. The Fiesta is tuned from the factory more for fuel economy than sportiness and there isn't much that can be done about it unless you want to reflash the ECU and get the car tuned professionally. I'm sure there is some perimeter in the system to tune up the responsiveness of the throttle.

    Second, The Fiesta has a smaller engine than your Beetle. It just might not be reacting the same way as the larger 2.0l to your inputs. Might just have to tweak your driving habits a little bit

    I know there was always a big difference in the feel of the car between my 2001 Focus (2.0l - 5-speed) and my wifes' 2000 Jetta (2.0l - 5-speed). The clutch on the Focus was very firm and the Jetta's always felt waaaay too soft (at least to me of course, lol. The wife always though the Jetta clutch was perfect and the Focus clutch was like pushing a rock uphill). If it had been a while since I'd driven the Jetta, I always had a probably with surging it off stops because the actuation points on the clutch/ gas were so much different than my Focus.

    I don't really think the issues you are seeing are faults or problems so much as they are just different from what you're used to. Depending on how long you've had the Fiesta for, it might just take a little time for you to learn the ins and outs. Good luck with the new car and please, let us know if you continue to have these issues in the future!
    Last edited by Slipster17; 12-13-2010 at 09:26 AM.
    OEM+ 2011 Yellow Blaze Metallic SES

    Carlisle AFN 2011 & 2013 1st Place Fiesta

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    1,586

    Default

    There's a TSB that sounds like it might apply to your car, Call your dealer about it and describe the issue and mention the TSB number.


    TSB 10-21-12

    ISSUE:
    Some 2011 Fiesta vehicles, equipped with a manual transmission may exhibit a slow return to idle. Idle may stay around 3000 RPM for an extended period before returning to normal.

    ACTION:
    Follow the Service Procedure steps to correct the condition.

    SERVICE PROCEDURE

    With engine temperature at or above 183 F (84 C), concern may be reproduced by depressing clutch pedal while coming to a stop after driving with the engine at or above 3000 RPM. Or, by raising engine speed above 3000 RPM with transmission in neutral.

    Reprogram the PCM to the latest calibration using IDS release 69.03 and higher. This new calibration is not included in the VCM 2010.9 DVD. Calibration files may also be obtained at Buy Motorcraft Parts Online | Official Motorcraft Auto Parts Site | FordParts.com.
    Does Engine start?
    Yes - End.
    No - Perform the Passive Anti-Theft System (PATS) Parameter Reset procedure. Refer to Workshop Manual (WSM), Section 419-01B.
    NOTE: NO START WITH PATS LIGHT FLASHING AFTER PCM REPROGRAM REQUIRES PATS PARAMETER RESET. THIS IS UNIQUE TO FIESTA FOR THIS CALIBRATION LEVEL ONLY.




    WARRANTY STATUS:
    Eligible Under Provisions Of New Vehicle Limited Warranty Coverage
    IMPORTANT: Warranty coverage limits/policies are not altered by a TSB. Warranty coverage limits are determined by the identified causal part.
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  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
    Posts
    985

    Default

    Good call Steve! I think I'll go bounce on down to the Ford Dealer and ask them about that.
    OEM+ 2011 Yellow Blaze Metallic SES

    Carlisle AFN 2011 & 2013 1st Place Fiesta

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    3

    Default

    Thanks both of you. I guess it all depends on what "Idle may stay around 3000 RPM for an extended period" means. It is certainly in the 3000 RPM range that this occurs, but I'm not sure I could fairly describe it as an "extended period." We'll see tomorrow; I'll call.
    Oxford White SES, manual

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Maynard, MA
    Posts
    56

    Default

    That's interesting about the TSB - I'll watch out for that behavior, too.

    On the other hand, I suspect what the OP is seeing is a combination of "rev hang" and different gearing than he's used to.

    I certainly notice it in my Fiesta and am still getting the rhythm down for shifting. Especially the 1st->2nd transition. I'm finding in need to mentally "skip a beat" before releasing the clutch in order to let the revs come down. Which bugs me because the car is not under power during that time. It also makes compression braking not work at all like I expect or am used to.

    I do understand the reason for the rev hang, tho, and so will learn to live with it.

    This is my my 7th or 8th manual car - I don't think it's necessarily a beginner's issue :-)

    -jim

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    3

    Default

    For those of you keeping score at home, the PCM recalibration did not make the issue go away. On the other hand, it increased the range of my Fiesta from about 380 miles to about 410. Dunno what that's all about...
    Oxford White SES, manual

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    1,586

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by scott View Post
    For those of you keeping score at home, the PCM recalibration did not make the issue go away. On the other hand, it increased the range of my Fiesta from about 380 miles to about 410. Dunno what that's all about...
    In that case you may need to get a custom tune to fix the issue.

    The SVT Focus was notorious for hanging revs and the only fix was a good custom tune, I had one done for mine and it not only fixed the rev hang but it also picked up about 15hp and 15 lb ft.
    AUTONATION FORD, WHITE BEAR LAKE

    Offering employee pricing on OEM and Ford Racing parts to all forum members.

    Now accepting online orders here http://parts.autonationfordwhitebear...?siteid=214771

    You can also find us here http://fiestast.net/

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Detroit
    Posts
    2,928

    Default

    I think my Fiesta has hanging revs at 2500 rpm.
    YouTube - hanging revs?
    eRic 2014 ST
    2011 SES
    2012 Great Lakes Solo Ser 1st STF
    2012, 2013 Detroit SCCA Solo Ser 1st STF

  10. #10
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    NH
    Posts
    100

    Default

    eRic,

    I see the same exact behavior as your video. I wonder if it is that TSB or if this is by design? Perhaps it keeps the motor from stalling when coming to a stop?
    I wonder what kind of flywheel is in these motors. It reminds me of when a stock cast iron heavy flywheel is replaced with a lightweight aluminum one. On my Audi you would have to slightly blip the throttle as the RPMS drop rapidly or it could stall.
    2011 Fiesta SE Hatchback | Ingot Silver Metallic | 5 Speed Manual | Rapid Spec 203A

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