[Drivenapollo]

I was reading through the post about oil leaks, and problems that people are having with the cars. For some reason I was wondering why we seam to have them and the euro doesn't. (maybe we need to join there forums lol) Anyway, so i check out the fiesta in the UK. It STARTS at $11,645 GBP. Which when converted to US its $18,181! I didn't look at there standard features but I thought that was a bit much. Maybe they have a few better parts? Maybe no oil leak issues? No speakers rattling?? hmmm..... What are your thoughts? Here is the UK site incase you wanna price your NEW UK fiesta.. lol

Ford Fiesta UK

Exchange Converter

* converted to the Euro its $14,993

 

[Audrey]

Early Adoption Comes With Risks

A few things to consider:

1. The economy of Great Britian, Europe, or any other region is going to differ from the US in ways that are not truly represented by currency conversion alone.
2. Everything you buy, no matter how long it's been on the market, will have the possibility of being faulty or having defects. Items that are new for the market have not been tested in the real world and this will have a higher tendency for problems. This part of the risk you accept as an "early adopter." It's also why warranties are expected with many new products. The European Fiesta has tested the Fiesta concept, but the North American car a different beast in many ways.
3. Not everything that goes wrong is directly under Ford's control. They use many suppliers and do hold them to their own expectations, but cannot directly manage the manufacturing of each component in the car.

 

[tjl]

Note that cars in the UK are generally more expensive.

Rule of thumb is that for most cars, take the US $ price and just change the $ to £. However, BMWs seem to be less expensive that that in the UK -- perhaps because BMWs have been marketed to a higher level of luxury prestige in the US.

Of course, that base model Fiesta in the UK comes with a 1.25L engine with 60hp and only 7% better fuel economy than the 1.6L engine with 120hp that is similar to the US Fiesta engine. Rear center head restraint, spare wheel, and curtain airbags are options. And if you want an automatic transmission, it is a £1,000 upcharge for an inferior 4-speed torque converter unit, available only with the 1.4L engine with 96hp.

On the upside, UK Fiesta buyers can choose one of three amazingly fuel efficient diesel engines, and also have options like parking sensors and rear view camera.

As far as defects go, the US Fiesta is at the very beginning of production, with a completely new supply chain. It is well known that first year of a new design cars tend to have more defects than later years of the same design (though a first year Honda is still likely to be more reliable than a later year Jaguar). Presumably, if you bought one of the first of its kind, you accept that small additional risk.

Remember also that European car buyers may be more tolerant of reliability and servicing issues; after all, they buy a lot of Volkswagen and Mercedes-Benz cars that do not have a great reliability reputation. Plus also French and Italian cars (check out the YouTube video on changing the headlamp bulb on a Renault Megane).

 

[mrbirdman330]

Almost 300 bucks to have a dealership change the headlamp bulb for your Megane is just stupid. The worst part is, you can't do it yourself.

 

[Zinky]

I've seen articles that say the UK has the highest list prices of any country in Europe & that southern Europe has the cheapest.

Another big factor is how many cars are sold to fleets, which demand big discounts. One article mention Mazda had 57% fleet sale in 2009 verses 38% in 2008 and they were aiming for even more in 2010. So if over half of your cars are sold at big discounts, raising the list price is going to have less of an affect on selling them.

If the prices are higher for retail customers, they probably should be able to expect more interior/exterior/engine choices for the extra money.

 

[Fiesta33460]

...but tax,tag, title is included

Keep in mind when comparing US car prices to UK, that prices in the UK INCLUDE 17.5% sales tax (called VAT), as well as registration or road taxes. That makes that $18K base model about $15K to start--still a lot for a stripped-down 3-door with a 1.25L engine and no a/c!

 

[GhiaFan]

Remember also that European car buyers may be more tolerant of reliability and servicing issues;

Yeah right, us suckers over here are a much more smiley bunch when our cars break down. Come on over and hang around the different auto brands service writers desk in a few euro countries and see if a Finn, Italian, Belgian, Brit, or French are more as you say "more tolerant"then Americans when their vehicle facks up .
Makes me cringe when I see this type of generalization.

 

[Casca]

Probably because when they make a US version, that version is going to a market that has over 300,000,000 people. I don't think even if you took all the countries in the EU and added up all their population that you'd get anywhere near the consumers that the US has and that every little individual European country has their own codes, regulations and hoops for manufacturers to jump through in order to sell to their population that doesn't even equal some of our states.

 

[mrbirdman330]

Europe and RoW have NCAP safety regulations which are more stringent that FMVSS and NHTSA since its now the EU where most things including car regulations minus the UK being RHD and still using MPH are pretty much the exact same. Lighting, airbag, pedestrian, braking, etc... are all a set standard of minimum to be sold in the EU. When it comes to NA, the dumber the car the more it sells because people don't actually have to think to actually operate it. One thing I absolutely can not stand on a lot of European Cars sold here in the US, lacking what makes them actually European.

 

[Audrey]

One thing I absolutely can not stand on a lot of European Cars sold here in the US, lacking what makes them actually European.

You mean the funny accent? ;b

 

[tjl]

One thing I absolutely can not stand on a lot of European Cars sold here in the US, lacking what makes them actually European.

Well, I like European driving characteristics and fuel efficiency, but without the special hard to find fluids, batteries, etc., overly complicated service procedures, and reliability problems (first hand knowledge as a former Volkswagen owner).

The Fiesta gets it right with the driving characteristics and fuel efficiency, while the fluids, batteries, etc. are easy to find. And changing bulbs is even shown in the owner's manual.

 

[Marc]

I've seen articles that say the UK has the highest list prices of any country in Europe & that southern Europe has the cheapest

This is also because cars in the UK are right hand drive, so production numbers of these cars are lower than continental European left hand drive cars.

 

[Rodewaryer]

Converting what the European customer pays for their car to US dollars isn't even a relevant comparison. What a dollar buys here, won't buy in their country. Everything there is relevant to their unit of currency. That's why in road tests when Euro cars are converted to dollars and then re-evaluated with cost considered it is again, not really a fair comparison. Their country's currency rate isn't within the manufacturers control to change. What something costs to build in the UK or Germany etc is different than here and based on their currency, not ours.

 

[mrbirdman330]

You mean the funny accent? ;b

That isn't funny.

Well, I like European driving characteristics and fuel efficiency, but without the special hard to find fluids, batteries, etc., overly complicated service procedures, and reliability problems (first hand knowledge as a former Volkswagen owner).

The Fiesta gets it right with the driving characteristics and fuel efficiency, while the fluids, batteries, etc. are easy to find. And changing bulbs is even shown in the owner's manual.

No I'm talking the advanced lighting they have where we only get ''Auto'' (for the lazy) ''Parking'' "Headlights'', Different HVAC systems, Many times Different Radio Setups, Also dumbed down tail lights which in many cases are converted from a 3 way to a two way. No amber rear turn signal and what is usually the rear fog lamp, is then converted to a brake lamp. Best prime example seen on first and second generation Subaru Outbacks and Legacy Wagons. Yes we all know about VW's horrible quality issues but most don't understand that's caused by VWoA and not VAG since VAG doesn't actually run VWoA. German built VW's that came to the US were fine. How to separate a German Built from a Brazilian and Mexican Built VW in the US. The VIN has W as the starting digit. Mexico is 3 and Brazil is 9, when you have a problem with it look at the VIN before blaming ''German Engineering'' on that matter. I'm also talking other advanced features European cars have such as safety standards and systems that are too numerous to talk about which also explains their prices in Europe and why they're higher. When you buy a car in Europe you pay the price of what it cost, meaning you get more than what the NA version has.

 

[tjl]

Yes we all know about VW's horrible quality issues but most don't understand that's caused by VWoA and not VAG since VAG doesn't actually run VWoA. German built VW's that came to the US were fine. How to separate a German Built from a Brazilian and Mexican Built VW in the US. The VIN has W as the starting digit. Mexico is 3 and Brazil is 9, when you have a problem with it look at the VIN before blaming ''German Engineering'' on that matter.

This is a well worn myth that is just a myth.

Early a4-platform VW Golfs were made in Germany, before production shifted to Brazil. The similar Jetta and New Beetle were made in Mexico. The German made Golfs were no less prone to typical failures of those cars, like window regulator clips, mass airflow sensors, brake lamp switches, hazard switches, cup holders, glove box doors, etc..

The b5-platform VW Passat was made in Germany. In 2002 or so, ignition coil packs failed at an alarming rate, to the point of requiring a recall (though the replacement parts were often backordered). In 2004, the rate of oil sludging in the Passat's most common engine, the 1.8L turbocharged engine, was realized to be so high that VW had to issue a clarified oil spec and change to a larger oil filter to increase the oil capacity.

Regardless of where the VWs were made, they also specified unusual fluids (and often times the specification was not clear, as in the 1.8L oil sludge problem which could have been avoided by a clearer oil specification from the beginning) and sometimes required excessively complicated service procedures (e.g. timing belts in diesel engines, or some current cars that require a VW-specific scan tool to reset the electronic parking brake after changing the rear brake pads). Even VW dealers do not seem to have a very good reputation for doing maintenance jobs properly on VWs.

 

[mrbirdman330]

Which becomes a corporate issue which should go all the way to VAG but VAG doesn't have much to do with VWoA. I know first hand what dealerships are like, I would constantly rent car trailers to customers who had to have their VW towed to another dealership due to one of three issues: 1, putting antifreeze in and not Dexcool blowing up the engine on the test run. 2, not properly torquing a head, bolt, or nut of some kind causing engine damage. 3, Severe overcharging of service to the customer for something simple. Then refusing to take responsibility for what they did!

But also understand this, do your research before buying a vehicle. A name alone shouldn't be your sole decision to buy a car. Understand what costs are, its something people seem to not understand. I for one even if I could afford it would not buy a Nissan GTR aka Skyline R35 model. The service for it alone for an oil change is almost 2,000 dollars. Don't know about anybody else unless they like to spend big wads of cash but I wouldn't pay that for an oil change. I believe the modern VW service done by the dealership is roughtly 100-200 Dollars. Mercedes, BMW the same, Audi the same. Its why I buy American.